Ben always has a plan, and he consistently lies to manipulate people. I'm almost sure he lied when he said he could not return to the Island. After all, if the 06 MUST return, even Locke's dead body, then Ben must return too!!

I guess.... I am the only one to have a different angle on this (if I have any bearing on my upcoming statements, which, I am sure you will all inform me). I think Ben meant exactly what he meant: The island is yours and Richard and the others will give you the secrets. Ben really has nothing to lose. He has (in my opinion) lost it all.
His love
Desire
Family
Faith
ect.
All he has now is revenge and of course a plan. How this plan ties into the oceanic six I am not sure. And I am still unsure of why Locke would leave his beloved island to talk to the oceanic six. Right in 2004 Locke becomes leader and in 2007 he is in the coffin? I think so, if I have followed the time line correctly. So, he lasted 3 years and now he is dead. Ben wants him to be renewed on the island and fix the mistakes that were committed.

Good points. But don't forget the will. Ben never loses his will

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"Bear...? Is that you?"-- Hurley S03E4

You're darn right about that. He always gets his way!

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Amee Eliza

You know Please, you may have just convinced me. But if somehow Penny ends up on the Island, I'll bet he finds a way to follow her there...to wreak his vengeance!

well food drops are gonna be hard now that the island is moved and good thinkin on top, i never thought how ben knew charles, i cant wait to find out

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-miamiLOST

Please it's awesome to know there's someone on this site who loves Ben as much as I hate him. Cuz I think the exact opposite of what you said.
I don't think his daughter's life was very important to him in the big picture. The only thing he seems interested in is whether or not Widmore "changed the rules".
After his confrontation with Widmore, my thoughts changed. I used to accept that Widmore was the bad guy, but now I'm not sure. We know he wants the island, but we don't know why.
I personally think he wants to reconstitute the DHARMA initiative, and that could be seen as good or bad. According to Pierre, that's what everyone should be doing.
(Pierre aka Candle aka Halliwax etc, from the DHARMA booth video at ComiCon)

Trismogistus, it's not that I love or hate Ben, but he is a compelling character. At present I have nothing to work on with Charles Widmore, other than the fact that he's Penny's dad, he seemed to want to "protect" her by keeping Des away, and most of all...he seems to be the one who sent Keamy in to massacre everyone who got in his way. I'm afraid this is all there is to inform me about Widmore's character. So far, he's revealed as a baddie.

I'm aware that Ben has murdered, lied and manipulated...but he's been so smart about it! What's not to admire?

The issue I have with Ben is that we, as viewers, can never really be sure if the information he gives out is true or a complete lie.
With a show such as this, there's already enough loose ends without having to sift through Ben's BS to find nuggets of half-truth.
Also, I find a leader who manipulates his own people to be both despicable and IGNORANT.
Yes I say Ben is STUPID and this is why:
Any leader should look to engage and deflect conflict without alienating or aggravating his/her own followers. Ben does the opposite and rules by fear and the false hopes he gives people through lies. If he was really smart he could have helped the survivors all out a little bit in order to control them more easily.
Anyone can tell you it's easier to get what you want through evil means, but it's much harder to hold onto it without a little compassion. I say if he really thought "big picture" he wouldn't have ordered the kidnapping of people and babies, instead he would have just told everyone WHY he wanted to do research, maybe people would be more inclined to help out?