thanks steph

And I like your theory about the tailies all 'destined' to die, which explains why Charlie has Fate out to get him (and maybe Bernard as well).

One more thing . . . to everyone who seems to think that Patchy has a twin and the 'old' Patchy is dead - I highly doubt it. Patchy is alive and well. If you go back to the episode where he supposedly dies from the sonic fence, you can see him breathing on the ground after our Losties pronounced him dead. And second, the producers hinted that he might still be alive in one of their earlier podcasts.

I have no explanation for the blood coming out of his ears, however.

That's very true, Naomi is the only source we've heard this from .. I know I think this every week but I seriously CANNOT wait for next week.

Fake-wreckage conspiracy has been discussed on this forum in two ways: either that the powerful big guys in the outside world who're backing up Others have found a way to create an actual wreckage scene and made believe the whole authories and investigators that what they got their hands on is Flight 815. OR that media technologies were used to create the false impression that Flight 815 was found crashed with no survivors. The movie Wag the Dog (1997, written: Larry Beinhart, dir: Barry Levinson) is a good example of how the effort required is not much of a deal given today's technology. There the government is creating a fake war plot in Albenia, a civil version of same manipulation, not quite impossible when Jakob's powers are concerned...

In any case, the forum seems to accommodate quite a number of supporters of both of these theories on how a fake-wreckage could be pulled --and there might as well be an altogether different explanation to all this. So we'll just have to wait and see

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"Bear...? Is that you?"-- Hurley S03E4

Naomi's first words to Hurley are "Where am I ?"

If she was sent to the island or to find the island wouldn't she know where she was? Or am I being too critical and this is just something anyone might say when waking up after a one-eyed man removed a branch sticking out of your lung in the middle of a jungle?

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Doctor playing golf. Woo, boy howdy, now I've heard everything. What's next, cop eating a donut?

Two points really : if the government were involved in faking the wreckage then fair enough, but at the moment we know of no government involvement. however, even with government involvement with the crash of a commerical airplane the authorities wouldn't just be able to show a video of it, because there would be a massive investigation into how and why it crashed as standard procdeure.

Second point : if only the wreckage was found then this would be much easier to fake .. however without any bodies would Naomi have really said "They were all dead" ? Well maybe she would have .. we'll have to wait and see.

Okay, Integrated, how about this: Even if there where no survivors of Oceanic 815, the others would still have to fake a crash somewhere else. Why? Because they couldn't afford to have anyone come poking around in there vicinity. So as soon as they saw the crash, they went into damage control. Wasnt' the flight off course for some reason? So as far as anybody knew, they crashed over the open ocean. They set up the scam from there. Probably something like "The crew of a privately owned research vesel conducting a study of the most shark infested area on Earth witnessed flight 815 break up in the air and scatter debris across 20 miles of ocean. After three days of looking for people floating on seat cussions, the search for survivors has been abandoned. A deep water salvage vesel, owned by Others Inc., was deployed to the area to retrieve the wreckage." And here's an extremely gross thought: The others waited untill the Tailies left the beach, dug up the bodies they buried, put them in the submarine, took them to the "crash site" and said "Hey look, we found some bodies." I know it's a stretch, but on this show, anything can happen.

I don't really care one way or the other if there were bodies discovered with the wreckage or not - I still contend that Paik, Mittelwerk, and Widmore have the goods to pull all of this off - completely outside the jurisdiction of any country's government. But if you are of the mindset that there would be bodies with a plane crash, consider this - 1. It's like Wednighter stated earlier - the Others' real-world source for lostie information was able to attain facts unknown even to government agencies (like James killing a man) so they are pretty up to date - and would know body weight, hair color, maybe even what they were wearing? 2. - The Others took blood samples of every lostie they came in contact with. There is a great DNA source to plant evidence for body identification.

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I agree- actually even the second wreckage theory sounds plausible to me now, since you've mentioned the blood samples & DNA thing. If no body survived from the wreckage (a fake wreckage actually put together), "bodies found" would not be all too identifiable either--that's where DNA obtainable from blood samples Others took could come handy to deceive the outside world that it's the Flight815 passengers.

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"Bear...? Is that you?"-- Hurley S03E4

It would be a little inconsistant (and again, very X-Files) to bring in a government conspiracy at this point in the story. Hopefully all these flashbacks are building to a larger picture that makes sense in the Lost universe.

Whether or not there is a cover up of their being survivors or not, I wonder if they are going to move the story to a point where we find out flight 815 was set up to crash. And also if we ever find out why. I just hope the pregnancy thing isn't the end of the story, interesting as it is.

ok.

A:first post! props to me!
B: Lets think about this logically. If i were to ask you what happened to the infamous AA flight 78 would you know what i was talking about? Probably not, unless i told you something about it specifically. It was the plane that crashed into the pentagon on 9/11... so Naomi has information on Oceanic 815 SPECIFICALLY. I don't think you could fake a plane crash(WAY too many variables there), but it wouldn't be hard to fake/fool someone on details about it, like i just did with you(it was AAflight77). With that being said, she was obviously misled.
C. Naomi cannot be a "good guy." If she was, she wouldn't be looking for a group of "They were all dead" people. She's there for either the others or Dharma, or Patchy individually, and since Patchy showed up, i'm leaning towards Dharma or Patchy, because Patchy is separate from the others. He has not been absolutely defined as part of the others.
D. She said "I'm not alone" which nobody understood, EXCEPT for Patchy. If she wanted it to be known to everybody she would have said it in english.
E. i like the conspiracy theory. Something is in the bigger picture here. The others have so much information on each individual. The dharma, or someones, crew drops supplies for losties(season 2 i think) so people know they are there, the question is who?
F. Finally, i really have no idea what i just typed. It took me over an hour to type, and this show is notorious for twists. So basically everything i just said means nothing haha. Thats why i love this show