This is actually the first thread that I have read in a long time that brings me back to the first season threads. I really enjoy the ones where we are trying to figure out the show and it seems like most of the threads from the end of season two until now has really been just us fans chitchatting about nothing to further along our investigations. I place as much of the blame on myself not posting anything, much less any substantial information, as I would any of you great members. I guess what I am saying is great thread.

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Trying to find myself ever since 9-22-04

Dharma might have been using them as construction workers or, like "Roger," as hired help for the more menial, non-scientific work.

Then, as Dharma took over more and more of the island, they rebelled (like the American Indians did as the settlers came in and tried to push them out of their land). (I'm just speculating, here).

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charlie98210
"Whoa!" she said. "Cry 'Havoc!' And let loose the dogs of war!"
And, like Banquo's ghost, they just won't go away.

Not a bad bit of speculation there, Charlie. Would explain a few things.

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"The Naked Gun!"

Frank Drebin remembers a lost love.

Frank: It's the same old story. Boy finds girl, boy loses girl, girl finds boy, boy forgets girl, boy remembers girl, girls dies in a tragic blimp accident over the Orange Bowl on New Year's Day.

Jane: Goodyear?

Frank: No, the worst.

It's no doubt along those lines. Almost like corporations and hostile takeovers in our world, translates to actual wars on the island.

So I wonder which side Jacob was on? Also, if The Others are descendants of pirates, how do they know about the red sox? (but not the brady bunch)

Probably some wierd communist ideal where you can watch TV for competition, but not for entertainment. Or Marsha's hot self.

According to the bible, Jacob was manipulator, used his intellect to deceive people into doing what he wanted. He deceived his father in order to get his older brother's blessing and inheritance.

Could Ben (who really seems to get off manipulating people) be deceiving the Dharma people on the mainland, actually running the Dharma Initiative on the island by deceit? Pretending to be part of the medical or psychological research group...and asking for stuff?

Like Juliet, the fertility specialist? Also, the Dharma folks could just be sending them news of the outside world with the supplies, not thinking it's any big deal.

And I don't think the crew of the Black Rock were pirates. Slave-runners, most likely. If they beached the ship on the island and freed the slaves and formed an island society, then that might be what's behind their conviction that they are the good guys.

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charlie98210
"Whoa!" she said. "Cry 'Havoc!' And let loose the dogs of war!"
And, like Banquo's ghost, they just won't go away.

Also wasn't Radzintski a member of the DHARMA initiative? (the person who use to work shifts with Kelvin in the swan before Desmond came) .. and .. for me .. even if kelvin was part of the dharma, he still didn't seem to like ''saving the world'' -> YouTube - LOST - Desmond - On the island
Personally I don't think kelvin was part of the dharma and I tink He killed radzintski during the purcghe .. and radzintski would of had a body, i think kelvin burried it somewhere that no1 was to know .. it's just what I think anyway .. to be realicstic , when did the purchge start and end? any1 know?

That's certainly some wild speculation without any proof =)

Kelvin's story about going to save the world for DHARMA does seem to fit as he was expelled from the army he probably thought it'd be the best thing to do with his life. He at least once talked to Desmond about the Hostiles. We know the Hostiles don't seem to care that much about the button and the hatch (Ben called it "nothing") so I doubt if Kelvin was one he would've stayed in there all that time pressing the button.

Most likely explanation, Kelvin was a real DHARMA employee who was transported to the island to work in the hatch with Radsinski.

Or maybe Kelvin wasn't living in the hatch before Desmond showed up. He did run up to him on the beach and brought him back to the hatch. So he was outside, saw Des, took him to the hatch... We don't know Kelvin was chillin in there before hand.